Post by Tehillim June 28, 2012 (51 of 60)
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dcramer said:
You know, although the SACD does sound better, it isn't all THAT much better than the CD and you can get a used one for approximately $13.50 or cheaper. Wilma Cozart Fine supervised the CD transfer and it's really quite good. Anyway, that's what I'd do if I was still looking for a copy.
Agree. I've been buying SACD's since early Telarc SACD days at original retail or below and if an SACD I desire is one of the exorbitantly priced collectable ones, I buy the CD version. The Mercury Living Presence Collectors Box set is a bargain by any measure with the included Starker Cello Suites the icing on the cake. While audiophiles appreciate the best version of a recording, most put more groceries before SACD's costing ten times their original list price.
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Post by seth June 28, 2012 (52 of 60)
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flyingdutchman said:
So the hell what. You think it's price gouging and being greedy (as if anyone should care what you think), most people think it's just a matter of allowing the market dictate what the price will be. So what that you go to sell your OOP item at Amazon for half the price because you're trying to be "ethical"...no one cares about that except you.
Right.
I don't think many people who list OOP discs for three digit sums are really all that interested in actually selling their copy. They just list their discs at that price in the off chance that someone is actually willing to pay it and delivery a very nice pay day.
From time to time I do see OOP SACDs listed for $20 to $40 -- no doubt by people who want to unload their inventory in a timely manner and realize how little appetite there is to pay more than $50.
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If you had asked me a few years ago, I would have thought it crazy to spend $$$ on an SACD. Today, I see things differently: the number of SACDs that are truly outstanding ... i.e. combine brilliant performance, superb sonics, great recording, and repertoire that is just up your street ... is, in my case anyway, quite small. If I had to choose between 1 of these truly SUPER discs (of which I would certainly include the Bach Starker SACD) ... or 10 mediocre discs .... I would easily ... anytime .... take the Bach Starker. In fact, I would easily take the Bach Starker in preference to 30 or 40 or 50 average discs. I don't really want the average discs at all.
So, the problem for me is not so much in actually paying the $$$ for that SUPER disc ... the problem is that one doesn't really know that it is a SUPER disc until you actually have it (or perhaps hear it at a friend's place). Only in having it does one realise its true value.
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Post by jackan June 28, 2012 (54 of 60)
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canonical said:
If you had asked me a few years ago, I would have thought it crazy to spend $$$ on an SACD. Today, I see things differently: the number of SACDs that are truly outstanding ... i.e. combine brilliant performance, superb sonics, great recording, and repertoire that is just up your street ... is, in my case anyway, quite small. I don't really want the average discs at all.
So, the problem for me is not so much in actually paying the $$$ for that SUPER disc ... the problem is that one doesn't really know that it is a SUPER disc until you actually have it (or perhaps hear it at a friend's place). Only in having it does one realize its true value.
So true. I liken it to a great meal. I gladly pay more for great food and great service. Lots more.
And in that same vein, I sometimes rely on reviews and suggestions.
I find the review section here a great help. But it has its drawbacks. Some of the discs that I have bought do not have the same appeal to me as the reviewer(s). Still, it is a great resource.
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One of the Amazon merchants told me that when a title becomes difficult to obtain or OOP they put the price up to some crazy high value to stop anybody from ordering. This is preferable to de-listing the item and then finding they can once more obtain stock. Obviously Ebay auctions are a better reflection of the true value of an OOP item and not necessarily Amazon.
Sadly I have had a number of instances of Amazon merchants accepting orders for things they cannot get and marking them 'shipped' then blaming the carrier for failing to deliver. The result is usually a dispute which Amazon resolve by issuing a 'gift certificate' to use on something else. I much prefer to deal with known mail order retailers but this site would not benefit.
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Post by dcramer June 28, 2012 (56 of 60)
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Tehillim said:
Agree. I've been buying SACD's since early Telarc SACD days at original retail or below and if an SACD I desire is one of the exorbitantly priced collectable ones, I buy the CD version. The Mercury Living Presence Collectors Box set is a bargain by any measure with the included Starker Cello Suites the icing on the cake. While audiophiles appreciate the best version of a recording, most put more groceries before SACD's costing ten times their original list price.
Yep, I'd buy the Mercury box in a heartbeat if I didn't already 90% of the titles on LP, SACD or CD. To mix metaphors, I'd take more music any day as opposed to only a slightly better wine list or a waiter with shinier shoes. On the other hand, I HAVE and will pay out significant geld for the best sonically available version of my short list of absolutely special, must-have recordings.
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Post by seth June 28, 2012 (57 of 60)
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old-dog-newtricks said:
One of the Amazon merchants told me that when a title becomes difficult to obtain or OOP they put the price up to some crazy high value to stop anybody from ordering. This is preferable to de-listing the item and then finding they can once more obtain stock. Obviously Ebay auctions are a better reflection of the true value of an OOP item and not necessarily Amazon.
Sadly I have had a number of instances of Amazon merchants accepting orders for things they cannot get and marking them 'shipped' then blaming the carrier for failing to deliver. The result is usually a dispute which Amazon resolve by issuing a 'gift certificate' to use on something else. I much prefer to deal with known mail order retailers but this site would not benefit.
I suspect something else that's going in is that people list something at an insanely high price to help boost the minimum they can actually get -- so they have two different listings. It's a lot easier to sell a used disc for $40 when there's a listing asking for $200.
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Post by Tehillim June 28, 2012 (59 of 60)
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dcramer said:
"I'd buy the Mercury box in a heartbeat if I didn't already 90% of the titles on LP, SACD or CD."
Yes. Same with me and the Living Stereo CD box set, although I have but sixty percent of that box set in SACD's. Anyone have an extra Living Stereo Traviata SACD on the cheap? I didn't think so.
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Post by Lunna June 28, 2012 (60 of 60)
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S, DC, T, R, DSD (and I must have left some out) - great posts. This is the kind of discussion I like, and why I really love this website! Really interesting stuff ... It does make sense, I guess, to post a crazy price and then sound magnanimous when you sell it at a (still) inflated price. Reminds me of some of the suks and bazaars I've visited in the Middle East - or some of the used car dealers around town!
Hmmm, interesting scenario - so, a dealer determines an item is hard to find, and then cranks up the price astronomically, yet he/she doesn't even have the item on hand. Wow, that is risky, if not sleazy. S/he better hope to be able to find that item and fast when some deep pocket comes along and calls the dealer's bluff! Of course then, the dealer will likely stall a little bit (since the money is too good to pass up and it is basically 'in hand') and scramble to find the item - price at that point being no object, since the profit he/she stands to make on the deal is so great anyway (I'm visualizing the banker on the Monopoly game board with the top hat and tails). In a pinch, he/she apologizes real innocently and says, "sorry, it's out of stock" or "sorry, i just sold my last one" or "sorry, i tried my best..." Or better yet - "I don't have the item anymore, but (bait and switch) I've got something just as good, if not better, for you."
... Actually, that's happened to me a few times in the past :) It ticked me off, but I always did get my money back when a dealer tried to pull that off on me - that's what credit cards (as opposed to cash) are for ...
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